Remove Pet for sale ads from the Startribune
March 7th, 2008
To help stop animal abuse the newspapers should stop making money from puppy brokers ads. Most papers I have contacted warned me that as many as 70% of ads are for puppy for cash frauds. So if there is a serious concern for animal rights the publications should stop advertising for these crooks and protect the dogs (animals) that can not help themself. If the ads were not allowed then the puppy mills would suffer a loss of revenue and lessen the abuse of animals. Nothing can stop these abusers of animals, but this action would help lessen the problems.
JB
Comments
Pet for sale ads in the Star
Pet for sale ads in the Star Tribune are generally placed by conscientious breeders and not by puppy mills, brokers or "crooks". Unlike many other newspapers, Star Tribune has staff that carefully screens this category of advertising because of the high fraud rate found with online pet advertising elsewhere. I found all three of my dogs through Star Tribune online ads and have had no complaints about the sellers.
Ginny - What do you mean by
Ginny - What do you mean by "conscientious" breeders? What is a consceintious breeder when millions of perfectly healthy perfectly adoptable animals are put to death every year due to the fact there are not enough homes for them because "conscientious" breeders didn't spay/neuter their puppies/kittens before they sold them for profit. How do you know the Star Tribune "carefully screens" this category of advertising? Do you work for them?
Julie - Yes, I do work for
Julie - Yes, I do work for the Star Tribune. Here's an excerpt from a recent internal e-mail. It's a good example of the screening work our ad policy team does to prevent fraudulent ads from being published:
"This advertiser came to our attention this morning. It's a Nigerian Puppy Scam, using the phone number and billing address of what appears to be a southern MN newspaper...but in [another system] the address is Bronx, NY.
This ad was submitted to Star Tribune from a computer located in Lagos, Nigeria. We killed the ad before it could run."
In my technical support role, I talk to many, many of our pet advertisers on a regular basis and I know that they care about the welfare of the animals they breed and sell.
I got a dog from a Startrob
I got a dog from a Startrob ad and the dog was sick. I know of many folks who have got dogs from the news paper ads and the pups came from puppy mills. There are several ways to tell
1. dogs for cash
2. meet you half way
3. cant show the parents
4. 10 small dogs for sale (yorkies cant have 10 pups)
5. many different breeds
6. out of state dogs
7. wont show their dirvers lic. to buyers
8. pups ready all the time
9. etc etc etc
All these items are seen daily in the news paper. So dont help the crooks/scamers get money for the suffering animals.
hermit
Buyers, please be aware.
Buyers, please be aware. Always do your homework no matter what source you use to find a pet, and know that MN statutes do provide some protection:
https://www.revisor.leg.state.mn.us/bin/getpub.php?pubtype=STAT_CHAP_SEC...
If you have a specific complaint about a particular Star Tribune pet advertiser, contact adpolicy@startribune.com and they will investigate.
Ginny -- A conscientious
Ginny --
A conscientious breeder will plan their litter in advance and will have a list of potential puppy owners for any potential offspring. The classifieds, especially at the Strib, are rife with backyard breeders who do zero health screenings and put two dogs of the same breed together (or two different breeds and call them "designer" dogs or worse, two mixed-breed dogs together).
You'll rarely find a reputable breeder advertising in a paper.
I guess it depends on how a
I guess it depends on how a person defines "conscientious breeder". Beyond a doubt, there are good breeders working hard to improve breed standards. Those of us who love a diversity of dog breeds should, at some level, appreciate these work of these breeders.
In my book, a "conscientious breeder" is performing genetic testing on their parents and puppies. They breed only a small number of animals each year, because they do not want to overwork their females. Additionally, because they provide good care for their dogs, they do not tend to have very many of them. The net result is few puppies being born to "conscientious breeders".
These breeders generally only produce litters of puppies after they have homes lined up for enough qualified, pre-screened homes. They virtually never have "puppies for sale". They have waiting lists of people wanting their puppies. These breeders would never place an ad in the paper in an attempt to sell puppies.
However, other people may lower their standards of what they consider a "conscientious breeder" to any breeder that is not openly violating the law. So I guess it depends on your perspective.
One thing is just about certain: every puppy purchased from a classified ad is a dog or puppy NOT adopted from a shelter or rescue group, where a surprisingly high percentage of purebred are looking for homes.
To suggest that the paper
To suggest that the paper can actually accurately screen breeders listing puppies for sale is not realistic. The paper is a publishing house, not a animal care oversight body. There are very responsible breeders. There are breeders that perform genetic testing on their adults and puppies. There are breeders that have waiting lists of animals - breeders that never breed dogs until they have homes for all puppies likely to result from breeding. Such breeders are, by any standards, responsible breeders.
None of the breeders in this category would EVER place an ad in the paper with puppies for sale. In fact, the fact that a breeder may have regular ads in the classified ads of a paper is the first "red flag" that should tell potential buyers of puppies to "stay away".
It is the buyers of puppies who are responsible for knowing that. Not the paper. However, I am very uncomfortable with the ads in the paper that say "Find your next pet in the classifieds."
On the other side of that argument, however, is the fact that shelters and rescue groups also advertise there.
While there may be some
While there may be some advertisers in the Strib who care about the dogs/puppies they are selling, a REPUTABLE breeder of QUALITY dogs/puppies will not normally advertise in a newspaper. Their puppies are sold before they even hit the ground. I don't think the OP is talking about the fraudulent ads. Here's the reality of newpaper ads:
AKC registered - not a measure of quality. Any purebred dog can be registered.
Champion bloodlines - a dog with a Champion grandsire is not going to necessarily look like the Champion grandsire. Good breeding can turn to bad in the matter on ONE GENERATION!
Vet checked - So, the vet checked them. Big deal. The vet can't check puppies for hip dysplasia, cardiomyopathy, genetic eye disorders. The parents need to be checked for these after the age of 2 years. Cardiomyopathy doesn't even show up then so the grandparents should be checked!
Shots/wormed - every good breeder sends a puppy home with proper vaccinations and parasite free. They don't have to advertise that.
A higher price doesn't mean a better puppy. Backyard breeders are now charging more for the following: extra large/small, "rare" colors (when really it was improperly bred colors), doodle mutts. Do your research. Find a good breeder first, the good puppy will follow. If people researched puppies like they research buying a new car or TV, the puppy mills and backyard breeders would be out of business.
When I was looking for my
When I was looking for my english bulldog I found many "crook" ads on Star Tribune.com I don't think the ads are as carefully screened as you think they are. There were so many that were "free" and all you had to do was pay for the airfare....an obvious scam. Anyways, I did end up finding my dog through an ad and I love her very much. She was very sick when I bought her and almost died due to the lack of knowledge on the breeders part. But I wouldn't change my dog for anything in the world. My opinion would be to look elsewhere for pets. Try the human society. There are plenty of animals that need help. And there are ALOT of scams on Star Tribune and many other papers.
From a former dog breeder, I
From a former dog breeder, I would say the Star Tribune is a very good place to advertise and find a dog. I always placed ads through the Star Tribune when I was selling puppies in the past. I made great connections with buyers and never ever had anyone unsatisied with the quality of the pet. Living in southern Minnesota at the time, most of our customers were from the Twin Cities. How else are they suppose to find a quality farm raised purebred AKC registered dog? I wouldn't guess an overnight delivery dog service, I won't mention the name, would be a wonderful place to start.
Always to further back the point. I recently found and purchased a dog I found on StarTribune.com/petcentral. I couldn't be happier with the quality or condition of this puppy. She is a purebred Beagle and after seeing a lot of Beagles and searching in multiple locations to find her, I couldn't be more satisfied.
With the reality of the internet these days, who are what can really be trusted unless you do your research. Ask questions if you are looking for the dog.
For instance:
1) Do you have the parents?
2) Are the dogs vet checked, do you have a copy of the vet papers?
3) What is the medical history of the parents?
4) How many litters has this mother had?
5) Double check that the breeder is not line breeding or in breeding.
Invest the time in your search and shopping for a dog, if you do, it will be worth the wait!
I bought my AKC shetland
I bought my AKC shetland sheepdog from an ad in Star Trib. When you buy a dog from a classified ad you have to ask certain questions from the seller/breeder to ascertain that they are reputable. I see some of the questions have already been listed above. I knew about the questions because I found them online, (where anyone can find them with a simple google search).
I found a breeder in northern minnesota who was extremely reputable. he and his family, who raise shelties drove down to the Twin Cities to meet me. They had verification of all information with them regarding the puppies' background, health certificates, etc., and answered all my questions. They also guaranteed my puppy's health for TWO YEARS.
The original poster's idea of forcing everyone to only purchase dogs from shelters is also ludicrous. I have the right to purchase a purebred puppy. The breeders who are reputable breed dogs that have excellent temperaments and are weaned properly, etc.
To accuse the Star Trib of being responsible for sales from puppy mills is ludicrous. THE BUYER is responsible to do thorough check before purchasing a dog/puppy. I am so happy with my sheltie that I bought from a breeder. He comes from a long line of top show dogs and he is really special. His body and coat are extraordinary. He is also extremely intelligent and has a great termperament.
Everyone wants to blame
Everyone wants to blame breeders as a whole. If one were to really look at the situation it is not all a breeder problem. If people were more responsible and committed to their dogs for the long run there would not be so many animals in the shelters/rescues.
If people spayed/neutered and kept their unfixed dog from roaming we would not have the "unwanted litters."
Irresponsible breeders are a big problem, but just as big of a problem is irresponsible owners. There are dogs that are brought back to humane societies because the owners find they do not have the time or the dog needs traning.
If you get a dog you are in it for the long haul. Training is a must. Be a responsible pet owner, do your homework and be dedicated. It is the uneducated people buying from puppy mills that are keeping them in business.
First of all- I as a rescuer
First of all- I as a rescuer have used the star trib
to find homes for dogs and cats many times. I was never
screened. I could have been a breeder.
Second, for anyone that doesn't think designer labeled
phoney AKC animals are a problem, then check the dead
barrel. OVERPOPULATION is the problem. OVER SURPLUS
is the problem and any one out there pimping animals for
money can't say they LOVE animals all that much. IF they
did they would be working to find a solution to the problems
-puppy mills, back yard breeders etc and stop the flow
of animals we have no where to go with except for a land
fill. The "good" breeders while I expect they exist, by
definition are still adding to the problem and should resist
the urge and keep their breeding to an absolute minimum
until there is a dog shortage and not a surplus. This is
a moral issue- not an income issue. It is very plain and simple.
I have been in the forefront
I have been in the forefront of the puppy mill agenda and i can say without a doubt that a large number of want ads in newspapers are fronts for puppy mills. And unless you really dig into the USDA inspection reports and actually force the people for these records you are not going to get to the truth by just what these people say. And if someone is a conscientious breeder they don't need to advertise in the paper.
I firmly believe the
I firmly believe the StarTrib should eliminate all classified pets for sale classifications. There are thousands and thousands of animals for adoption already---through Petfinders.com (which is a rescue only group) and through rescue groups of almost every breed of dog and cat. There are so many other rescue groups where the animals have already been fostered and are ready for adoption. To name just a few: Feline Rescue, Animal Ark, St. Francis Rescue, Underdog Rescue, Second Chance Rescue, Last Hope Rescue--I could go on and on.
PLEASE CONSIDER ELIMATING PETS FOR SALE ADS!!
Thank you. Judy Candell Minneapolis 55403
I firmly believe the
I firmly believe the StarTrib should eliminate all classified pets for sale classifications. There are thousands and thousands of animals for adoption already---through Petfinders.com (which is a rescue only group) and through rescue groups of almost every breed of dog and cat. There are so many other rescue groups where the animals have already been fostered and are ready for adoption. To name just a few: Feline Rescue, Animal Ark, St. Francis Rescue, Underdog Rescue, Second Chance Rescue, Last Hope Rescue--I could go on and on.
PLEASE CONSIDER ELIMATING PETS FOR SALE ADS!!
Thank you. Judy Candell Minneapolis 55403
I firmly believe the
I firmly believe the StarTrib should eliminate all classified pets for sale classifications. There are thousands and thousands of animals for adoption already---through Petfinders.com (which is a rescue only group) and through rescue groups of almost every breed of dog and cat. There are so many other rescue groups where the animals have already been fostered and are ready for adoption. To name just a few: Feline Rescue, Animal Ark, St. Francis Rescue, Underdog Rescue, Second Chance Rescue, Last Hope Rescue--I could go on and on.
PLEASE CONSIDER ELIMATING PETS FOR SALE ADS!!
Thank you. Judy Candell Minneapolis 55403
I agree. There's an uproar
I agree. There's an uproar every time someone tries to sell a puppy or dog on Craigslist (they'll only allow "rehoming" fees) or eBay. Why is it acceptable for puppies to be sold through the newspaper? Maybe if the backyard breeders and puppy mills had a harder time getting the word out about their puppies, we'd get rid of them altogether.
I purchased both of my dogs
I purchased both of my dogs from Star Tribune ads and both dogs turned out not only great, but better than we expected!
I picked out ads from the breeds I wanted and read the ad carefully.
Both ads emphasized the fact the puppies were family raised with lots of love.
Both breeders provided all kind of information about their dogs.
The first breeder described how her female loved her squeaker toy, and even kept it with her when she delivered her litter! She sent pictures of the male and female, and was very aquainted with lines, temperments, and most importantly, the "personalities" of her dogs. She met us 1/2 way from Iowa to deliver the pup, and although I never met the parents nor saw her breeding operation, I could tell she truly loved her dogs. We had many conversation over the phone, she sent many pictures, and supplied plenty of funny stories about her own dogs!
We visited the other breeder at her farm, and she showed us both the male and the female,. She also gave us a history of each of the dogs, why she bred them because of their personality match and their lines, and even gave us a history lesson of the breed! She also helped us pick out the puppy that would be best suited for us, we didn't want a puppy that was overly dominant, nor too shy.
I think with anything you need to be aware of the pitfalls and dangers of any type of advertising (look at the Craigs list horror stories) that may not be on the up and up.
But for my experience I got two great dogs from great people - all through classified ads.
I agree STOP PLACING PETS
I agree STOP PLACING PETS FOR SALE ADS,the ONLY people who are placing these ads to sell puppies etc are from PUPPY MILLS & yes even KITTY MILLS,BACKYARD BREEDERS,PEOPLE IN IT FOR THE MONEY ONLY. Every year their are over 4 MILLION ANIMALS DESTROYED in this country,
the Star & Tribune is not helping this sick injustice to STOP!
I have worked in animal rescue for over 3 years and if people adopted a animal from a shelter or a responsible rescue organization that would help with this HUGE,SICKENING problem,be responsible and have compassion and think of the POOR INNOCENT LIVES that are
put down in gas chambers across the county EVERY DAY!
Bottom line people want to
Bottom line people want to buy puppies. No amount of sob stories is going to change their mindset to adopt an adult dog. If they can't find them in paper classifieds they'll find them at the pet store in the mall.
There is absolutely no
There is absolutely no reason whatsoever to adopt puppies from puppy mills or pet stores. There are abundant supplies of puppies with rescue groups. Puppy mill puppies can be inbred and unhealthy due to poor breeding practices, lack of vet care and unsanitary conditions - so a risky choice that may be costly and even tragic. Anyone who has nursed a sick puppy will tell you it's heart wrenching and expensive.
I thought you bought puppies
I thought you bought puppies from pet stores, not adopted them?
That aside, here's a question for you...you say you shouldn't buy puppies from pet shops or puppy mills because they can be inbred and unhealthy. I certainly agree with you! But, that being the case, where do all the puppies originally come from that the rescue groups offer? Pet stores and puppy mills?
hmmmmm.....
I consider adopting to be an
I consider adopting to be an appropriate term no matter where the pet is acquired. A living thing should be adopted not bought.
Of course dogs in rescue come from many sources. The puppies with rescue groups are usually unwanted litters. Puppy mill dogs generally come into the rescue system as adults, and potential adopters are made aware of their background, health issues and other potential problems. Many adopters are willing to take on those risks/problems. I'm not sure what point you are trying to make - that rescue dogs are potentially unhealthy and/or may have come from puppy mills? True. But, if everyone refuses to do business with puppy mills, eventually that practice will go away and there will still be puppies aplenty to adopt.
Bottom Line is that
Bottom Line is that perfectly good adoptable and Yes even purebreds are being put down everyday!PUPPIES and Adults
Bottom Line is that I don't care if people are going to the newspaper,online,or a pet store,THEY all come from the same horrible place(puppymills,kittymills,backyard breeders etc.) and people need and should have a conscience and a Heart and Do Not contribute in any way to this horrific tragedy! I work in rescue and if you saw what I have seen and heard it would make sick to your stomach! A people are going to do what they are going to do is not an acceptable
attitude the poor animals deserve a lot more!
Brian, Do you seriously
Brian,
Do you seriously believe puppies are not put down everyday in the US? I have bad news for you-they are. Many. Just puppies. Health, happy, but no one came to get them and a full shelter had no choice.
I agree with everything you
I agree with everything you said, except the part about the shelters having a choice. They actually DO have a choice. Don't believe me? Check out the video Strayed: The Story of How the Animal Welfare Community Lost its Way.
It is time for them to stop using the excuse that they have no choice, and get busy solving the problems that cause animals to enter their shelters in the first place. The so-called "pet overpopulation problem" is solvable and had basically been solved in several communities in the USA. Doing so takes strong leadership from the shelters. So long as they say, "we have no choice" then the problem will never be solved.
I'm looking for a GSD
I'm looking for a GSD purebread, preferably with very strong European bloodlines. Can anyone point me in the right direction on who might be a reputable breeder? It seems like it's pretty thin right now in the strib. Thanks!
I wasn't exactly sure where to put this since I didn't initally see an animals search spot.
There's a local breed club:
There's a local breed club: http://www.gsdcmsp.org/ It's the best place to find a reputable breeder. For ANY purebred dog, the local/regional/national breed club is the best place to find a well bred puppy.
I found my puppy through the
I found my puppy through the Star Tribune and I'm pretty sure the ad was a scam. At the time I was skeptical on the situation but I took him home anyway...partly because I immediately fell in love with him and partly because I didn't want him to be further victimized in the puppy mill system.
I was going through the "warning list" and basically checked yes to more than one of them: The breeder was supposedly so far up north that this particular lady was selling the puppies on his behalf. I wasn't able to see the parents, nor was I able to take home any of the AKC papers (he was going to mail them to me). I got my puppy in September and I have yet to see these papers. After waiting for a very long time (I don't remember the exact timeframe but it was over 5 months), I cancelled my check and still haven't heard from them about it. My boy has very minimal issues, non of them health related, and we're working through them. I would never even think of surrendering him.
I'm just hoping that something bad doesn't happen to me or my credit down the road as a result of this now worthless check...
Perhaps instead of trying to
Perhaps instead of trying to restrict what the Strib can publish, you put your energies into educating the pet buying public so they can avoid buying from puppy mills.